US bars Muslim leader

[chickenfeet]

This is the sort of thing that makes me despair of the US government. Do they really want to send the message to ordinary, law abiding Muslims that in the opinion of the United States there is no difference between them and a suicide bomber? You know what? That rapidly becomes true. If you treat reasonable people as enemies that's likely what they will become. If Tony Blair had an ounce of sense and decency he'd be reaming Bush over this nonsense. I'm not holding my breath.

Comments

[thais.livejournal.com]

Heh.

I tried to argue "If you treat reasonable people as enemies that's likely what they will become" with some of the people on my friends list. Who were threatening to "Boycot [sic] Islam" -- that is, to refuse to patronize Muslims and any business that end up having any Muslims on the payroll.

People are daft. And in the very worst ways possible.

[chickenfeet2003.livejournal.com]

Yeah, we should boycott all Christians because of the IRA. I can tolerate the fact that there are fools in the world, it just depresses me that the US administration is 99% idiots and the balance are psychopaths like Karl Rove.

[tanuja.livejournal.com]

At the same time can we ban certain "Oirish" Americans because they funded the IRA through NORAID, and I'd also like to see their bank accounts being frozen, please. Oops, silly me, the IRA were freedom fighters and it was a purely "domestic" problem, therefore not terrorism.

Grr, mutter, mutter, grrrrr.

[jen-c-w.livejournal.com]

hmm. See your point entirely about the Irish Americans payrolling the IRA - hey Rumsfeld set up Al Quaeda let's not forget so perhaps we could ban him? - but I do think there is a difference between freedom fighters and terrorists. Freedom fighters do have an end, however distasteful their means of trying to achieve it, with terrorists the means are the end: i.e. they solely wish to achieve death and destruction.

[chickenfeet2003.livejournal.com]

By your definition, very few groups would count as "terrorist", certainly not AQ, which most certainly has an agenda. I can't think of any current group that believes in terror for the sake of terror though I suppose the Red Army Faction and the Red Brigades would have been close when they were active.

[jen-c-w.livejournal.com]

aq has an agenda? And all the sub-cells of of it. I mean aq never really existed as something like the IRA does - it was the list drawn up of those equipped to fight the Soviets, and as for now, with no central command whatsoever, it's just a group of loosely affiliated murderers, who just hate the West and want to destroy it. I suppose you could call that an agenda...?

[chickenfeet2003.livejournal.com]

AQ certainly has an agenda. Ultimately its aim is the reestablishment of the Caliphate at Baghdad and the completion of the Prophet's original aim of bringing the whole world into the Dar al Islam. Structurally it's different from the IRA but it's quite wrong to assume it's aim is just to destroy the West.

[jen-c-w.livejournal.com]

you think that those 3 kids from Leeds were thinking like that then? I just think that groups associated with AQ are a lot less generic in thought than IRA/ETA. Plus it seems somehow less likely than achieving independence for the Basque region or a united Ireland...

[chickenfeet2003.livejournal.com]

I don't know what the three kids (?? one of them was 30 and a father) from Leeds were thinking though at least one of them was fairly educated.

How many of the Provisional IRA's foot soldiers understand or are committed to the creation of an United Soviet style Socialist Ireland? How many are just in it for the easy money from the booze and cigs racket?

How many American squaddies have a clue what they are doing in Iraq?

I agree with you that AQ's aims are decidedly far fetched but that hasn't stopped people pursuing them for the last 1300 years or so. Besides, are they any more far fetched than the aims of the neocons in the US administration? The world, sadly, is overpopulated with people ready to use violence to attempt to impose simplistic solutions in a complex world.

[jen-c-w.livejournal.com]

agreed - I don't think there's anything in particular novel about aq in terms of MO - first suicide bombing napeolonic wars wasn't it?
PIRA - hmm, I'm not sure. I initially thought they were fairly committed, but then recent events suggest it has become about the drugs/cash racket.
US Squaddies - well of course they didn't volunteer to go to Iraq...they're just carrying out the orders of the government - and whilst there are undoubtedly acts of needless destruction carried out there, I don't think you can claim they are terrorists.
Men of 30, with or without children of their own, adults? I don't think so...
I could make some snide remark about sports science at Leeds Met but instead I'll just say that receiving education does not equate to intelligence - you only have to see the bigoted attitudes of many politicans to see that.